Powers since publish 8

Jedi profession discussion
StepoKedur
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Hi all!

Firstly a huge thankyou to the devs for sortng out whatever the issue has been the last couple of days. Awesome job lads and lasses!

The community came together as a whole in these forums too. It's great to be part of this community :)

Now as it was posted that a couple of tweaks were added to the server during the rollback period, I wonder if there is anyone brave enough or daft enough as of now to have gone mPowers either before the roll ack or today, just after?

I wonder how choke does now, is it worth it, and has anyone seen any improvements from last week to the past months and/or last week to today?

If choke (at least) did a decent amount of damage and/or had a great debilitating effect on the enemy, both player and NPC it could be worth getting mPowers. However as we are in the dark I hope a brave soul has tried this. Of course if you have and don't want to declare it please send me a PM :)

Anyone notice anything else different, anything new and improved since today (or even an interesting change from a few months ago to last week's respec?

Thanks!
Last edited by StepoKedur on Wed Apr 26, 2017 9:59 am, edited 1 time in total.
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shaitoninvar
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i have not respecced yet...i thought this was only on test center?!

Is it live?

I intend on staying Mpowers, but i doubt they have fixed animal attack and such

I have yet to see anything on the forums that indicate powers has been "fixed" (i.e. skills actually working) and choke being worthy and comparable to Msabers

I don't even know if they fixed the states line in enhancer?

Maybe i just haven't seen a thread on it, but these things are a HUGE factor in determining how we should respec

Cheers :)
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Cynar
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Powers is highly dependent on bonuses from the FRS. The they get stacked early and often.
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shaitoninvar
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Is animal attack working?
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Cynar
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You'll have to test it to find out.
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shaitoninvar
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Cynar wrote:You'll have to test it to find out.
Is the test server up so i can "test" this?

I can't seem to log in

Thanks in advance

I was just looking for a thumbs up or down if the skills were fixed.

My apologies if i missed the patch notes saying the skill is fixed or not.
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Test center will be back up once publish 9 has been loaded.
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RemusStorm
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shaitoninvar wrote:
Cynar wrote:You'll have to test it to find out.
Is the test server up so i can "test" this?

I can't seem to log in

Thanks in advance

I was just looking for a thumbs up or down if the skills were fixed.

My apologies if i missed the patch notes saying the skill is fixed or not.
Publish 8 was on test server for over a month, should of prob tested this stuff back then???
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StepoKedur
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Some things were only active once it went live though Remus. Enhancer resist states did not stick in the buff bar but does in live now. Not sure if the resist works, suppose it needs a ton of data to check though.

So unfortunatly some things were untestable. It makes things a very pleasant surprise in live, but expensive to check.
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StepoKedur wrote:Some things were only active once it went live though Remus. Enhancer resist states did not stick in the buff bar but does in live now. Not sure if the resist works, suppose it needs a ton of data to check though.

So unfortunatly some things were untestable. It makes things a very pleasant surprise in live, but expensive to check.
Incognito and I have no idea what you are talking about. All of the code, minus custom non-Jedi code was in for the last 10 days at least. Maybe it was just not displaying correctly on your client?
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StepoKedur
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As an example, the other enh defence items worked, bonnie lights flashed around me, icons appeared in the buff window. States however just said 'states are applied' or whatever the blub is, followed instantly by 'states have expired' as the others do after 15 minutes. Nothing appeared in the buff window. It was as if the 15 min timer for me was a split second, just for state resists from enhancer.

Unfortunatly I don't think I have a screenie.

I wonder if others noticed this? It was only in the last few days of test centre before live.

That's why I hope to find out if mPowers' choke (at least) has improved. :)

The other skills have a nice reward for going master.

mDef has avoid incap, mEnhancer has FR3 and regain conciousness, mHealer has total heal self and total heal other, mLS has 85% block, capped speed and great damage output, where (although tweaked here already, and I'm not entirely sure how much tweaking was done) mPowers has choke (which is reportedly not enough for a master box, but I have no personal experience with that box here).

Prior to pub 8 and Awakening tweaks I understand jedi mind trick was not in game as is/was anything from subjugate. Then again I don't think it was in any emu.

Could anyone that has tried mPowers in the (recent) past also let me know what choke does now, damage wise and what fKD3 adds to the fKD line? I think it has a higher radius to fKD2.

An interesting thing that was noticed, and Dunka, Dani and Neimad can back me up here too as they noticed it - was that any state I put on an enemy in PvP last week was 'sliding back off them' rather fast. Dunka actually seems surprised by it!

Now don't take these as complaints, far from it. Just looking for info. If it's not quite right, force powers, I won't consider it. This is more a fact finding thread. I have used lightning and will continue to anyway as well as weaken/int.

See what the replies are that come in.
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shaitoninvar
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Force Choke

IF you can get it to land....BIG IF (this applies to lightning attacks too....miss miss miss evade miss etc....)
Initial dmg=600-700
Ticks after 350-400 per tick lol
500 FC per use

Powers has a HUGE accuracy problem.....STILL (you would think Master Powers would get some love over the dabblers in powers....especially in the accuracy dept and maybe FC.....oh well..)

Weaken 1 and 2 stack but does nothing to mind pool

Mind blast is still useless along with throw and mind trick and...well you know.....

Don't even have choke on your bar....it's a total waste of a CD...and a HUGE FC drain at that (2k + FC to get it to hit and then the laughable dmg from it)

All of the AI stuff (animal skills) is still broken

Hope this helps those who are interested.

Cheers :)
StepoKedur
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Thanks Shai :)

So, as I mentioned earlier (and this is going into the FRS)...

Five disciplines of the jedi profession.

Two damage disciplines: LS and Powers.

Three defence disciplines: Defender, LS and Enhancer.

One healing discipline: Healer (duh!)

Two augmentation discipline: Enhancer and Powers.

At master, all should have a decent bonus due to a he expense of each discipline.

MDef: all innate defence skills, uses no force to apply or use apart from a tiny bit force for avoid incap.
MHealer: one hit button to clear all states, bleeding, fire etc. Can heal all apart from fire on others. Total heal self not quite living up to it's name heal HAM wise.
MLightsabre: a few 'wasted' skills, but each LS tree has it's own benefits. Great degree of defence against ranged (LStoughness and 85% block) and against LS attacks. Strong attacks at master.
MEnhancer: awesome defence against force powers. Armour and shields are a nice alternative or addition to defender, but as it should, comes with a force cost as they require a few boxes rather than a master. At master can get up as soon as an incap takes place and force run to safetly to heal up and potentially return to the fight.

For the next one it's important to remember that powers were to be a viable alternative to lightsabre, albeit a little more 'glass' in thier defences.

MPowers: lightning at LS damage at 2 second cooldown. Almost instant casting. 2 second cooldown makes lightning only half the DPS of a lightsabre. Force cost is quite high. Choke at master is weak and not an alternative to any DOT weapon. Weaken can be good against an enemy (PvP if it hits and lightning is lucky, same as force KD. As Shaiton says, the accuracy seems off on these, the force is remarkably high (think of the lack of force used for an mDefender to do what they can) and the casting is incredibly slow. May take 5-6 seconds or more to cycle a force KD or a choke.

Now that I have some answers about mPowers, and that the FRS is coming up, what could be done to allow mPowers to be that viable alternative to lightsabre?

As powers is supposed to be offensive (still only half the DPS of a lightsabre if the lightning hits of which is severely gimped in a class called 'power' that is supposed to be an offensive class at the cost of defence) how should powers be tweaked to get into the FRS? True the FRS will boost powers, but it boosts all other jedi skills too.

A powers jedi would have very little chance of getting into the FRS to make his or her skills viable, while other jedi disciplines are already enjoying a foot up to rank in the FRS.

Greater accuracy? Faster casting times? Greater choke effects (only available at mPowers after all)? Greater benefits of weaken at master? Lower force cost? (Again, look at what an mDef can accomplish without using force, and then using avoid incap for very little cost).

I have been lucky enough to speak with a few crazy assed mPowers users last couple of days. Those folks are brave! :) They all say the same thing. In order for powers to be viable in any combat or FRS a couple of tweaks really should be made. The counter of course are enhancers and lack of any great defence.

We don't know what tweaks are coming up in the next few weeks. We don't know what tweaks are in pub 9.

Is there a chance that powers could be de-gimped before pub 9, to open up more diverse templates and allow different playstyles?

I know it's a bit of a read there, but that's how it is. It's how I feel from my research and how powers jedi feel.

What are everyone elses thoughts?
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Brianklein33
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StepoKedur wrote: I wonder if there is anyone brave enough or daft enough as of now to have gone mPowers
Just call me Mr. Dafty Brave.

I've tried it in both BH and Jedi vs Jedi PvP, I can tell you right now it will be a frustrating struggle. However, I am stubborn and still went this even after the roll back.

We had a good 3v3 Jedi battle going on in Theed yesterday and I got a ton of good testing in. Its a balancing act if you want to be successful. I can tell you this, if you run in attempting to do "MADZ DPS" you will have a bad time. However, if you bide your time, provide light pressure to mix up targets, then focus damage/ KD at the right times you will shine.

I ended up losing in the fight, but I was happy knowing I provided several "Holy s*** that was close" moments for the other team. I will get better as I learn, it is a game and I am going to play the template I have the most fun with.

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StepoKedur
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Aye, I watched some of that fight, and thankyou for the personal demonstration too :). Much appreciated.

I totally understand being clever with these skills...it is an odd profession at the moment!

As an experienced mPowers would you say my comments above your post were on the ball or am I missing something? As a 'viable alternative to lightsabre' the DPS definatly has to increase somehow, without shooting your force pool in a few seconds ;) - the DPS is already half that of an mLS...
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Hard to say without the FRS. Powers gains such a boost from it. If the Staff were to say FRS will never hit awakening, yes, then I agree we need help. However, with FRS comming down the road... I don't know?

We are late bloomers for my Friend. ;D

I would like to see animal attack, if I could have turned all those flewts outside of theed onto those rebels. It would have been game over.
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shaitoninvar
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The biggest problem is the accuracy against Defenders and defense stackers (non-jedi)

Something changed even before publish 8 where it was noticeably MUCH harder to KD a stacker than lets say 1 yr ago.

For some reason, Thak started having a noticeable effect vs. Force KD (funny a consumable negates a MPowers ability......)

Force KD was extremely powerful against stackers on live. Thak didn't help either. Thak was only useful against saber throw (different dmg type and category etc..)

This was THE difference Mpowers had over Msabers. Powers could KD anyone or anything. Saberthrow could NOT.

Now a passive Mdefender can negate most dmg due to the insane amount of misses.

Non-jedi also won't get hit too often if they have alot of dodge/defense (which was not the case on live).

The two things that really sucked on live for Mpowers was the insane long casting times and the FC.

At least they fixed the insane long casting times (however the GCD of KD + dmg still remains).....however something went a miss with the accuracy vs. non-jedi stackers

Hopefully they will want the FRS to be competitive among the various options that are available to Jedi, however to gain FRS xp one must be able to hit with said skills from Mpowers to GET FRS xp

Otherwise its just a FOTM stick-wielding Msabers 4xx4 Heals xxx2 Enh fill in the rest

I do like the change to force run, however it would be nice not to wait the 90 secs to re-engage in pvp.

I would propose a 30 sec timer for both FR1 and FR2 so you can switch to escape if needed and not have to wait so long to get back into combat to do dmg but at the same time not just toggle them at will. Still have to plan or be smart when you want to use them kinda thing
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shaitoninvar wrote:The biggest problem is the accuracy against Defenders and defense stackers (non-jedi)

Something changed even before publish 8 where it was noticeably MUCH harder to KD a stacker than lets say 1 yr ago.

For some reason, Thak started having a noticeable effect vs. Force KD (funny a consumable negates a MPowers ability......)

Force KD was extremely powerful against stackers on live. Thak didn't help either. Thak was only useful against saber throw (different dmg type and category etc..)

This was THE difference Mpowers had over Msabers. Powers could KD anyone or anything. Saberthrow could NOT.

Now a passive Mdefender can negate most dmg due to the insane amount of misses.

Non-jedi also won't get hit too often if they have alot of dodge/defense (which was not the case on live).

The two things that really sucked on live for Mpowers was the insane long casting times and the FC.

At least they fixed the insane long casting times (however the GCD of KD + dmg still remains).....however something went a miss with the accuracy vs. non-jedi stackers

Hopefully they will want the FRS to be competitive among the various options that are available to Jedi, however to gain FRS xp one must be able to hit with said skills from Mpowers to GET FRS xp

Otherwise its just a FOTM stick-wielding Msabers 4xx4 Heals xxx2 Enh fill in the rest

I do like the change to force run, however it would be nice not to wait the 90 secs to re-engage in pvp.

I would propose a 30 sec timer for both FR1 and FR2 so you can switch to escape if needed and not have to wait so long to get back into combat to do dmg but at the same time not just toggle them at will. Still have to plan or be smart when you want to use them kinda thing
Toggling it on and off is a part of pub 9. Turning it off and on comes with great force cost though.
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StepoKedur
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Brianklein33 wrote:Hard to say without the FRS. Powers gains such a boost from it. If the Staff were to say FRS will never hit awakening, yes, then I agree we need help. However, with FRS comming down the road... I don't know?

We are late bloomers for my Friend. ;D

I would like to see animal attack, if I could have turned all those flewts outside of theed onto those rebels. It would have been game over.
Heheh :) Aye, but Mr Packers, it's a chicken and egg situation. Powers needs the FRS to be viable, but cannot get into the FRS easilly unless it's viable. Mostly a viable alternative to mLS as it has been intended to be here on Awakening.

The thing is would casting times be easy to reduce? Would force cost be viable to reduce? Would it even be permitted? So many questions :)

What realistic tweaks could be put forward?
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Interesting about FR Cynar :)

Also, very true Shai - one must be able to compete in the FRS to progress in the FRS. If different templates were used first, then staying in the FRS would be very difficult while regrinding almost a full spec on jedi again, possibly dropping out of the FRS while doing so. No other branch of jedi would really have that issue.



I hope by the way this thread is seen as constructive rather than anything else. I feel we are on the same page so far with comments, and would hope to be able to offer some ideas for tweaks that are not overpowered but allow a possible issue to be negated. :)
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Stepo Kedur (jedi, M Smug/TKM)
Stepp (M Smug/M TKA)
Steave (Ent&art)
http://www.about.me/stepokedur